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PostPosted: May 18th, 2011, 1:30 pm 
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Joined: March 8th, 2010, 4:08 pm
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I just got an email regarding condominium fees due for Pizzo Beach Club. The period covered is from January to June 2011. The amount of 800 euros was to be paid by the 16th of may! This is almost a 30% increase on our previous bill of 2010 (June to December) Has anyone else received such an email? We have a 2 bedroom 1st floor apartment.

Regards Fran.


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PostPosted: May 18th, 2011, 5:20 pm 
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Joined: December 2nd, 2009, 3:16 pm
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Location: N Ireland
Fran, yes I received an email on Apr 30th for 442.80 euros for 1-bedroomed apartment. I replied to say that I'd transfer 1/2 of this as I only completed on Apr 12th and said I assumed the Jan-June was a mistake - received no reply. It was great to meet Fiourina at Easter.


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PostPosted: May 18th, 2011, 5:52 pm 
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Joined: February 25th, 2010, 5:47 pm
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Didn't everyone pay condo charges as part of the final invoice when they completed for Aug-Dec 2010 even though very few had completed. My understanding is that condo charges kicked in when developement was habitable.
Just my understanding and i haven't even completed yet.

Barney


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PostPosted: May 19th, 2011, 7:34 am 
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Joined: September 12th, 2009, 2:49 pm
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Your condo fees are effective once your condominium has been set up. You shold have all been called to a meeting and agreed the rules and budget. This is a legal requirement. Also you should have been given a table/chart as to what you all pay depending on what the table has calculated out. These rates all depend on following a legal process that looks at where your apartment is situated, (floor, facing, size, bedrooms, use of any lifts - ground floor use will be lower than top floor etc etc). If you have not had this initial meeting and seen and signed the condomiunium paperwork, then I suspect that you do not have one set up according to the legal requirements or they have missed out some very important steps. All owners are required to approve the budget and any spending during the year at the initial meeting and at an AGM from then on. I suggest you ask some more questions before paying any more money.


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PostPosted: May 19th, 2011, 10:27 am 
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Joined: December 2nd, 2009, 3:16 pm
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Location: N Ireland
That's useful, sunflower, thanks. No meeting organised yet and no condominium rules sent to us or signed (although someone on the forum did have access to them somehow a few months ago)


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PostPosted: May 19th, 2011, 3:23 pm 
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Joined: August 5th, 2009, 1:48 pm
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Do anyone know who is acting as the administrator of the site?
Is it VFI og Maritur or someone else. The email asking for the fee was signed by "The administrator".


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PostPosted: May 19th, 2011, 4:27 pm 
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Is it not the case that the builder/developer controls everything for the first year, since a lot of people (us included) have not completed yet. After that, the owners can take over and that's when the proper condominium is set up? That's what we were told by the VFI rep the first time we went to see the site. He definitely mentioned that VFI could do it - although I don't know if that's who IS doing it. Also, as much as it doesn't seem right that we should have to pay fees for the time before we actually complete, I'm sure I read somewhere (probably on the forum) that those charges that everyone is being billed for now, cover the set up costs of the site facilities, and things that have been in place since the first completions happened - eg, filling the pools, running the reception (which I think has been going for a while now), sun loungers and umbrellas etc?

Someone correct me if I'm wrong.


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PostPosted: May 19th, 2011, 4:52 pm 
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you might be right about the builder doing the administration the first year, but the cost for filling the pool, sun loungers and umbrellas was included in the connection fee, so this has already been paid for.

I have asked for a budget which shows the cost to get some clarification of why the fee as so high, but not received anything yet.

-Henrik


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PostPosted: May 20th, 2011, 12:29 pm 
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Joined: September 12th, 2009, 2:49 pm
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It is usual that the "builder " manages the site for the first while but you will find that the law states a condominium has to be established after a small number of units have been sold. I believe this is 4 -8. You will probably before it (the condominium) is set up have to pay for the Millisimali table to be drawn up which is quite costly. You the owners appoint an administrator and this can be whom ever you want provided it is voted in by the majority and if you are unhappy with their performance you can vote them out at any point.
The relationships between the co-owners are regulated in general terms by the law. The Italian Civil Code (Codice Civile) dictates the main principles, whereas two documents, issued either by the original builder or subsequently agreed by all owners, effectively provide detailed rules of daily practice.

Of these two documents, the "condominium regulations" (Regolamento di Condominio) will dictate how the common parts of a building can be used, and regulate the complex relationships between co-owners (flat owners).

The other document, the "condominium tables" (Tabelle millesimali), will address how actual maintenance expenses / repairs costs of the common parts (service charges) will be paid for. How such expenses will be shared between individual flat owners.

You will have to hold "regular" meetings between the owners or owners representatives, again this is the law and discuss what is happening on the development and manage the budget. additional expenditure not already agreed in the budget, will have to be presented to the owners and voted on.

So you may have a "self appointed" administrator in the beginning but this can be changed. It is usually beneficial to stick with the builder until everything is completed but again - time will be the issue here. Hope this helps!


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PostPosted: May 22nd, 2011, 8:36 am 
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Joined: December 29th, 2010, 7:35 pm
Posts: 16
I also received the latest bill for condo fees from Jan to June for €. 1.437,40
and I have informed them that I have no intention of paying the condominium fees until the builder has paid the compensation payments they owe me.


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PostPosted: May 22nd, 2011, 1:23 pm 
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Joined: March 16th, 2011, 2:57 pm
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wow that seems steep...................


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PostPosted: May 22nd, 2011, 4:19 pm 
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Joined: December 2nd, 2009, 3:16 pm
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Location: N Ireland
LeeMunden, I presume this is for a villa?


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PostPosted: May 23rd, 2011, 9:18 am 
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Joined: December 29th, 2010, 7:35 pm
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Yes, I am in V15


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PostPosted: January 17th, 2012, 12:39 pm 
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Joined: July 12th, 2009, 9:47 pm
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Does anyone know the legal position re paying Condiminium fees please?... they are trying to charge us for 3 months when we did not even own the property as we had not completed!


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PostPosted: January 17th, 2012, 7:20 pm 
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Joined: September 12th, 2009, 2:49 pm
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You are only liable for condominio fees from the day you take over the ownership of the property. You should speak with the administrator and tell them to check the italian civil code - I do not have the rule number to hand.
You cannot be liable for something that you do not have ownership of...as usual someone is trying it on!


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PostPosted: January 17th, 2012, 9:49 pm 
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Joined: July 12th, 2009, 9:47 pm
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Thank you for that Sunflower... it confirmed what we thought!


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PostPosted: January 23rd, 2012, 5:23 pm 
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Location: N Ireland
I was told that the condo fees have to be paid from when the complex is habitable, for PBC this was August 2010 according to the builder. They have to be paid from that date even if you don't sign for your apartment until much later. The builder is currently paying the condo fees for the apartments that are not yet completed (presumably out of the deposits puchasers paid him). Sunflower, are you 100% sure about what you said "You are only liable for condominio fees from the day you take over the ownership of the property"? - I hope you are correct but that's not what the PBC condo administrator/receptionist says.


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PostPosted: January 23rd, 2012, 7:47 pm 
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Joined: May 29th, 2010, 6:52 pm
Posts: 63
Location: Canada
I understand property owners did not complete at the same time. Even though they have made a deposit and the unit is listed in their name waiting for them to complete and not for sale to potential investors correct? I understand there has been troubles with certain Lawyers and companies selling PBC. I do feel for them and we had our own concerns along the way. The condo fees are about PBC and all investors, so paying the fees should not be a concern, and if they are list it for sale and move on


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PostPosted: January 23rd, 2012, 8:30 pm 
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Joined: March 21st, 2008, 3:59 pm
Posts: 213
We have today received an email from the administrator threatening legal action if we do not pay - despite the fact that they sent us an email last year acknowledging receipt of our payment!! Also, if, as we have all been told, we are all expected to pay from August 2010, and the builder is paying for those apartments that have not been sold, what then happens when they ARE sold? Is the builder going to charge the new owners, backdated to August? - unless they inflate the purchase price they won't get away with it - no-one is going to pay for something they didn't own!! And regardless of whether you paid a deposit or not, you don't legally own the property until the date of completion.


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PostPosted: January 25th, 2012, 11:09 am 
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Joined: September 12th, 2009, 2:49 pm
Posts: 154
Havingbeen involved with condominiums for the past 25 years or so I am very sure that you do not start paying until you own the unit. The builder would have to pay as he is the "current" owner of those properties and once a condominio is started "everyone" who owns property has to pay. Once the builder sells those units then the next owner takes over the responsibility. This is usually written in the contracts and the new owner has to abide by the condo rules whether they agree or not to them. This is why the builders do not want to set up the condominio too early as it costs them and thse people who have been "given" property in payment for services money as they are then legally bound to contribute what ever the 1000th tables states. There is plenty of information on this in the italian civil code.


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PostPosted: February 15th, 2012, 12:11 pm 
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Joined: February 1st, 2010, 4:25 pm
Posts: 93
Sunflower what in your experience are the bestskills to look for in an Administer .


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PostPosted: February 15th, 2012, 8:55 pm 
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Joined: September 12th, 2009, 2:49 pm
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In this case honesty!!!!. However lacking that you need absolute transparency. You need them to produce a budget that accounts for all the condominio fees collected over the year. You need someone who will work with your owners group that will be in place as a go between between the administrator and the owners and who will over see that the administrator is acting accordingly. They should be registered with an accredited membership of condominio administrators and have much experience in the field. You need to trust the person/s and this can only be achieved with complete openess and transparency. good luck!


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PostPosted: February 17th, 2012, 3:35 pm 
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Thanks for that. There are a lot saying you can only appoint a qualified ITALIAN Administrator. In your experience is this the case


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PostPosted: February 18th, 2012, 7:17 pm 
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Joined: September 12th, 2009, 2:49 pm
Posts: 154
I expect it would be beneficial but it is not necessary... I have never seen anywhere where nationality was a requirement ....You need someone who is familiar with italian civil code and condominium rules in Italy and that they are accessible to the development and I still go on to say that in this neck of the woods honesty and transparancy are the most important. If you can get those 2 elements in place you will perhaps get round everything else. Would people rather have a dishonest italian?? Maybe thats what you should be asking them.


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